Tonight, the House Select Committee to Investigate the January 6th Attack on the U.S. Capitol held a televised hearing to vote on whether to hold Trump’s White House chief of staff Mark Meadows in contempt of Congress for defying a subpoena. Their answer was yes, unanimously, by a vote of 9–0. More, even than that, though, was that in order to justify their votes they dropped some details about what happened on January 6.
It is 4:14 am and we're heading to our hotel in Savannah, GA several days early after a disastrous and heated argument with my In-laws after dinner. The gist of the argument, among other things, was January 6, Trump's hand in it and how it was a lawful expression of true patriots. The straw that broke the camel's back was the repeated use of the phrase, "Why should/do you care?" whether or not those who attacked Capitol are held accountable? Or that voting rights are being throttled or that people are struggling. "You're doing fine, why do you care about anyone else?" And they mean precisely that.
I think if each of us on this page listen closely to family and friends who have been sucked into the void of Trumpism you'll find that they, too, simply don't care about anyone other than themselves. Their words and actions tell us that they don't care. My husband and I have gritted our teeth since Obama was elected listening to the bigoted, racist, hateful bullshit and have argued against the right wing crap they've dished out. Last night was the last straw. No more.
People who ask, "Why do you care?" that our democracy is in jeopardy have no interest in building a better society. Listen to them. They are telling you the truth. They. Do. Not. Care.
It seems to me that Meadows' sudden refusal to cooperate with the Jan. 6th Committee only lends credibility to the material he has submitted, such as that quoted by HCR above. It also seems his actions point to the probability that the material he now chooses to withhold is even more powerful evidence of an overt conspiracy to overthrow the US government, a coup d'etat, at the very least abetted by the president.
Liz Cheney's courage and fortitude highlights the groveling cowardice, the supreme hypocricy, of her fellow Republicans.
This confirms Donald Trump carried out his proposed shooting and killing of someone on 5th or was it 7th Avenue in broad daylight moment.
I agree that many who support Trump will not care anymore than those who attended a mob lynching, shooting or burning of black people ever cared about what happened to the black victims, black population, their own community, state or nation.
I am watching the news of the tornado destruction through the southern midwest and thinking how out of touch the people are with their own politics of small government, keep the Federal government out, no aid for NYC and NJ after hurricane Sandy as they seek donations and aid wherever they can. We are either independent individuals and states on our own or we are a united people and United States.all together. Which is it?
Humanity seems to have two kinds of people. Those who are generous and those who are exploiters. My reading of history is that those with the least are most likely to give the most of what they have to those in need. This seems to correspond with original Christian teachings about love and charity. Until we get our priorities back, we will struggle. Those destroyed by the tornadoes will be experiencing both generosity and exploitation. If only they realize where this comes from.
Will Congress act to expel those members who are complicit in the insurrection? Will the military remove the benefits of Flynn and Waldron (and others) and court martial them? Or will everyone forgive and forget as Andrew Johnson tried with Confederates after the Civil War?
On another note, I hope Liz Cheney is well protected. She has shown incredible courage and tfg’s followers are conscienceless.
Here we are once again. Another "avalanche" of criminal evidence on the doorstep of the White House and in the Oval Office of Donald Trump. If this isn't treason, I don't know what is . . .
And yet no comment or movement from AG Merrick Garland and the Department of Justice. The only way to stop Trump and his cronies is to INDICT them immediately and prosecute them with all deliberate speed. Were Trump to be convicted of just one of the scores of felonies he committed while in office, he would be barred from holding Federal office ever again.
We sit here day-in day-out, months go by, even years, dazed by the enormity of a bona fide sociopath and what he has done to destroy the institutional fabric of our Republic and Democracy. If the rule of law, so fundamentally critical to our Republic, is not going to be enforced, then we are witnessing the fall of Rome all over again . . . .
Tonight we can be proud of Dick Cheney’s daughter. Liz stood against Wyoming racist base fascism without speaking a word about race or Wyoming or Mormons. She is not her father. She is better, but she won’t turn on him, only on Trump. To get all this, The Cruelty Is The Point by Adam Serwer is the book to read. Carefully. This once very angry young man has come to talk about what matters. He understands what. He has work to do to understand why. But he feels it. He really feels it. Why may take him another decade. Why is complex. Heather Cox Richardson understands what, too. She gets what. Her antiseptic dry fact based historical approach is powerful - now and then. She does not concern herself with why. She knows her limitations. Historians, some, are triumphant with what. “The Past, Present, and Future of Trump’s America” by Adam Serwer will shine light where darkness rules: right here. “The negro still hopes that some day the United States will become as great intellectually and morally as she is materially to protect and honor all her citizens regardless of “race, color, or previous condition,” and thus make her professions a living reality.” - Ida B. Wells, May 28, 1894
Pete Hall's post Re: Pam Smith (ME) was spot on. I have said from the beginning that Trumpism is a cult. Being a person who has no capacity to care about others, and who believes that the only thing that matters in the world is him, Trump follows in the path of the world's past fascist leaders, who also created a dangerous cult. The difference however is that cults we know about, like Jim Jone's, or Moonies, did not entail taking down an entire country. "De-cultifying" is a long and arduous process and there isn't any other way to reattach the followers to society and its norms. There is no logic, fact or anything else to change their minds. The cracked cup analogy is incredibly accurate. The thinking being "Who are you to tell me differently! I'm better than that!" It's a personal affront. In fact, EVERYTHING is a personal affront, which is why every social issue has become a personal issue. Now there is nothing on the Right that is NOT an issue. Secondly, and as a retired teacher, I say this sadly, Our education system has failed on many fronts. Years ago (and of course this is not every single teacher) geography (as a whole), governments (around the world and ours)and exactly how they work, history (not edited history) were not taught or not taught thoroughly. But most importantly, deep, even difficult discussions and close discernment of information was not practiced. I believe the sheer decline of liberal arts focus in the college contributed to this. Narrowing education to a particular field and basically that field only, took away, what used to be a solid two years of exploring other points of view, being exposed to things we might never have looked at or learned, which allowed us to have a different and a more honest perspective on the world. Retreating into our own bubbles, retreat of broader based education, lack of understanding of how even the basics of Democracy works (which is key to understanding what the Right is doing to our country) has caused an epidemic of isolationism within our country and within a large portion of the population. Those who scream most strongly about their loss of privileges and rights have NO understanding that destruction of this government will make sure they never have those rights and privileges again, How can you if you don't understand that breaking every norm, politicizing every office and branch of government to one's own ends, results in destruction of what we hold most dear.
My concern is that the people who believe the Big Lie are not hearing any of the findings from the committee. They are only hearing over and over from Fox News and other right wing media sources that there is a witch hunt going on. I wish I could believe that there will be some new people that realize how complicit Trump was in orchestrating the insurrection and what that actually means for our democracy, but I think the committee is only preaching to the choir. How do we stand up to the right wing propaganda machine when they have the complete and total attention of so many people?
Accountability for Jan 6 will be adjudicated in the courts, and ultimately in the Supreme Court. I am very interested in the nexus of The Federalist Society, the Republican Party, and the Supreme Court. And their involvement with former president Trump and the Trump White House. What did individuals in these groups do to incite the Republican mob and what did they decline to do to dissuade it? (I have purposely left out the Fox mob capo di tutti i capi and Murdoch consiglieri.)
I am particularly interested in religious extremist activists Ginni and Clarence Thomas, who are as thick as thieves with the Federalist Society and the Republican Party; of course Clarence sits on the Supreme Court. The Thomases had extraordinary access to and involvement with the Trump White House - with Ginni consulting regularly in an advisory capacity (notably in providing Trump with a hit list of Executive branch and agency officials to fire or hobble) and the couple often dining with Trump. Justice Thomas has never recused himself from cases where he might reasonably be judged to have a conflict of interests.
Congress had its chance to hold Donald Trump accountable, including by preventing him from running for office again. But despite formidable work by Democrats in the House and by the House Mangers before the Senate, and the support of Senate Democrats, the effort failed before the legislative tribunal. It failed despite meeting the burden of proof in production of evidence to bring the charges and in burden of persuasion to establish the preponderance of evidence, and even it can be reasonably argued, proof beyond a reasonable doubt. (I am using these terms in the context of standards set by Congress and not those of the courts.) It failed because of obstruction of justice by Senate Republicans, most significantly by GOP Leader Mitch McConnell and notably by the 'Federalist Society Caucus' including Texas Sen.Ted Cruz and Missouri Sen. Josh Hawley.
Well, we know what Hawley was doing on Jan 6 - fist bumping his maga hat, armed militia, and camo cos play co conspirators on their way to sacking the Capitol to overturn the election, while he was on his way to join Cruz in using procedural violence to accomplish the same goal. In fact, once the self appointed Trump incited mob was cleared from the Capitol and the Senate reconvened, in fealty to Trump the elected Republican crew continued to obstruct certification of the Electoral College vote, even after all they had witnessed. After a forced recess of over 5 hours to accommodate violent Republican physical obstruction, Cruz et al kept their procedural obstruction going for over 3 hours before voting against certification.*
So now it goes to the Federalist Society packed courts, and the Federalist Society dominated Supreme Court.
We know what Federalist Society honcho John Eastman was doing leading up to Jan 6 - making conclusory
assertions about election fraud and scheming a legal argument, without legal or factual basis, to overturn the election. And of course, on Jan 6 Eastman was a featured speaker at the Trump rally . We know Ginni Thomas was broadcasting on social media her support for the rally at which Eastman incited the protestors to violence.
There are sins of commission and sins of omission. So I am interested in Trump whisperers and Trump amplifiers who may have privately contacted Trump but, despite having privileged access to public platforms, did nothing to dissuade either Trump or the Republican insurrectionists from sacking the Capitol to overturn the election.
*As a note, Republicans like to point out that House Impeachment Manager and House Constitutional scholar, Maryland Rep.Jamie Raskin raised objections to certification of the 2016 vote, but Republicans fail to mention that Raskin and other House Democrats made their objections for the record, knowing full well that no Democratic senator supported them and so their objections would not impede Senate certification of the Electoral College vote. Of course, in 2021, GOP objections were in service of overturning the vote.
Now we need to pull them through climate, guns and autocracy. It's nothing new, we just must do everything we can to keep pushing this country ahead with liberty and justice for all. This is what many generations have done before us and now is our time.
I am constantly amazed at how much I root for Liz Cheney. And how afraid I am of those who who are trying to tear down our democracy. We must keep telling the truth and telling the truth and supporting those who do.
So, when is Angel-hair-pasta-for-a-backbone AG Garland going to stop going after the little fish for misdemeanors and start hunting the sharks? As more than a few former federal prosecutors have said, they went after Mafia Dons with less evidence than now exists here.
It will be interesting to see how the R's vote on the resolution to hold Meadows in contempt tomorrow. I kept hoping all these investigations would get us here but my head is still spinning.
It is 4:14 am and we're heading to our hotel in Savannah, GA several days early after a disastrous and heated argument with my In-laws after dinner. The gist of the argument, among other things, was January 6, Trump's hand in it and how it was a lawful expression of true patriots. The straw that broke the camel's back was the repeated use of the phrase, "Why should/do you care?" whether or not those who attacked Capitol are held accountable? Or that voting rights are being throttled or that people are struggling. "You're doing fine, why do you care about anyone else?" And they mean precisely that.
I think if each of us on this page listen closely to family and friends who have been sucked into the void of Trumpism you'll find that they, too, simply don't care about anyone other than themselves. Their words and actions tell us that they don't care. My husband and I have gritted our teeth since Obama was elected listening to the bigoted, racist, hateful bullshit and have argued against the right wing crap they've dished out. Last night was the last straw. No more.
People who ask, "Why do you care?" that our democracy is in jeopardy have no interest in building a better society. Listen to them. They are telling you the truth. They. Do. Not. Care.
It seems to me that Meadows' sudden refusal to cooperate with the Jan. 6th Committee only lends credibility to the material he has submitted, such as that quoted by HCR above. It also seems his actions point to the probability that the material he now chooses to withhold is even more powerful evidence of an overt conspiracy to overthrow the US government, a coup d'etat, at the very least abetted by the president.
Liz Cheney's courage and fortitude highlights the groveling cowardice, the supreme hypocricy, of her fellow Republicans.
Liz Cheney's speech was powerful. https://youtu.be/pA7scwOVcrw
This confirms Donald Trump carried out his proposed shooting and killing of someone on 5th or was it 7th Avenue in broad daylight moment.
I agree that many who support Trump will not care anymore than those who attended a mob lynching, shooting or burning of black people ever cared about what happened to the black victims, black population, their own community, state or nation.
I am watching the news of the tornado destruction through the southern midwest and thinking how out of touch the people are with their own politics of small government, keep the Federal government out, no aid for NYC and NJ after hurricane Sandy as they seek donations and aid wherever they can. We are either independent individuals and states on our own or we are a united people and United States.all together. Which is it?
Humanity seems to have two kinds of people. Those who are generous and those who are exploiters. My reading of history is that those with the least are most likely to give the most of what they have to those in need. This seems to correspond with original Christian teachings about love and charity. Until we get our priorities back, we will struggle. Those destroyed by the tornadoes will be experiencing both generosity and exploitation. If only they realize where this comes from.
Will Congress act to expel those members who are complicit in the insurrection? Will the military remove the benefits of Flynn and Waldron (and others) and court martial them? Or will everyone forgive and forget as Andrew Johnson tried with Confederates after the Civil War?
On another note, I hope Liz Cheney is well protected. She has shown incredible courage and tfg’s followers are conscienceless.
Here we are once again. Another "avalanche" of criminal evidence on the doorstep of the White House and in the Oval Office of Donald Trump. If this isn't treason, I don't know what is . . .
And yet no comment or movement from AG Merrick Garland and the Department of Justice. The only way to stop Trump and his cronies is to INDICT them immediately and prosecute them with all deliberate speed. Were Trump to be convicted of just one of the scores of felonies he committed while in office, he would be barred from holding Federal office ever again.
We sit here day-in day-out, months go by, even years, dazed by the enormity of a bona fide sociopath and what he has done to destroy the institutional fabric of our Republic and Democracy. If the rule of law, so fundamentally critical to our Republic, is not going to be enforced, then we are witnessing the fall of Rome all over again . . . .
Tonight we can be proud of Dick Cheney’s daughter. Liz stood against Wyoming racist base fascism without speaking a word about race or Wyoming or Mormons. She is not her father. She is better, but she won’t turn on him, only on Trump. To get all this, The Cruelty Is The Point by Adam Serwer is the book to read. Carefully. This once very angry young man has come to talk about what matters. He understands what. He has work to do to understand why. But he feels it. He really feels it. Why may take him another decade. Why is complex. Heather Cox Richardson understands what, too. She gets what. Her antiseptic dry fact based historical approach is powerful - now and then. She does not concern herself with why. She knows her limitations. Historians, some, are triumphant with what. “The Past, Present, and Future of Trump’s America” by Adam Serwer will shine light where darkness rules: right here. “The negro still hopes that some day the United States will become as great intellectually and morally as she is materially to protect and honor all her citizens regardless of “race, color, or previous condition,” and thus make her professions a living reality.” - Ida B. Wells, May 28, 1894
Pam B
just now
Pete Hall's post Re: Pam Smith (ME) was spot on. I have said from the beginning that Trumpism is a cult. Being a person who has no capacity to care about others, and who believes that the only thing that matters in the world is him, Trump follows in the path of the world's past fascist leaders, who also created a dangerous cult. The difference however is that cults we know about, like Jim Jone's, or Moonies, did not entail taking down an entire country. "De-cultifying" is a long and arduous process and there isn't any other way to reattach the followers to society and its norms. There is no logic, fact or anything else to change their minds. The cracked cup analogy is incredibly accurate. The thinking being "Who are you to tell me differently! I'm better than that!" It's a personal affront. In fact, EVERYTHING is a personal affront, which is why every social issue has become a personal issue. Now there is nothing on the Right that is NOT an issue. Secondly, and as a retired teacher, I say this sadly, Our education system has failed on many fronts. Years ago (and of course this is not every single teacher) geography (as a whole), governments (around the world and ours)and exactly how they work, history (not edited history) were not taught or not taught thoroughly. But most importantly, deep, even difficult discussions and close discernment of information was not practiced. I believe the sheer decline of liberal arts focus in the college contributed to this. Narrowing education to a particular field and basically that field only, took away, what used to be a solid two years of exploring other points of view, being exposed to things we might never have looked at or learned, which allowed us to have a different and a more honest perspective on the world. Retreating into our own bubbles, retreat of broader based education, lack of understanding of how even the basics of Democracy works (which is key to understanding what the Right is doing to our country) has caused an epidemic of isolationism within our country and within a large portion of the population. Those who scream most strongly about their loss of privileges and rights have NO understanding that destruction of this government will make sure they never have those rights and privileges again, How can you if you don't understand that breaking every norm, politicizing every office and branch of government to one's own ends, results in destruction of what we hold most dear.
My concern is that the people who believe the Big Lie are not hearing any of the findings from the committee. They are only hearing over and over from Fox News and other right wing media sources that there is a witch hunt going on. I wish I could believe that there will be some new people that realize how complicit Trump was in orchestrating the insurrection and what that actually means for our democracy, but I think the committee is only preaching to the choir. How do we stand up to the right wing propaganda machine when they have the complete and total attention of so many people?
Liz Cheney should receive the Presidential Medal of Freedom, and more women should be elected to bring some sanity to the government.
Thank you for including links in the notes.
I hope for an avalanche of indictments, convictions, and LONG prison terms.
Maybe now people will see the Emperor had no clothes.
Accountability for Jan 6 will be adjudicated in the courts, and ultimately in the Supreme Court. I am very interested in the nexus of The Federalist Society, the Republican Party, and the Supreme Court. And their involvement with former president Trump and the Trump White House. What did individuals in these groups do to incite the Republican mob and what did they decline to do to dissuade it? (I have purposely left out the Fox mob capo di tutti i capi and Murdoch consiglieri.)
I am particularly interested in religious extremist activists Ginni and Clarence Thomas, who are as thick as thieves with the Federalist Society and the Republican Party; of course Clarence sits on the Supreme Court. The Thomases had extraordinary access to and involvement with the Trump White House - with Ginni consulting regularly in an advisory capacity (notably in providing Trump with a hit list of Executive branch and agency officials to fire or hobble) and the couple often dining with Trump. Justice Thomas has never recused himself from cases where he might reasonably be judged to have a conflict of interests.
Congress had its chance to hold Donald Trump accountable, including by preventing him from running for office again. But despite formidable work by Democrats in the House and by the House Mangers before the Senate, and the support of Senate Democrats, the effort failed before the legislative tribunal. It failed despite meeting the burden of proof in production of evidence to bring the charges and in burden of persuasion to establish the preponderance of evidence, and even it can be reasonably argued, proof beyond a reasonable doubt. (I am using these terms in the context of standards set by Congress and not those of the courts.) It failed because of obstruction of justice by Senate Republicans, most significantly by GOP Leader Mitch McConnell and notably by the 'Federalist Society Caucus' including Texas Sen.Ted Cruz and Missouri Sen. Josh Hawley.
Well, we know what Hawley was doing on Jan 6 - fist bumping his maga hat, armed militia, and camo cos play co conspirators on their way to sacking the Capitol to overturn the election, while he was on his way to join Cruz in using procedural violence to accomplish the same goal. In fact, once the self appointed Trump incited mob was cleared from the Capitol and the Senate reconvened, in fealty to Trump the elected Republican crew continued to obstruct certification of the Electoral College vote, even after all they had witnessed. After a forced recess of over 5 hours to accommodate violent Republican physical obstruction, Cruz et al kept their procedural obstruction going for over 3 hours before voting against certification.*
So now it goes to the Federalist Society packed courts, and the Federalist Society dominated Supreme Court.
We know what Federalist Society honcho John Eastman was doing leading up to Jan 6 - making conclusory
assertions about election fraud and scheming a legal argument, without legal or factual basis, to overturn the election. And of course, on Jan 6 Eastman was a featured speaker at the Trump rally . We know Ginni Thomas was broadcasting on social media her support for the rally at which Eastman incited the protestors to violence.
There are sins of commission and sins of omission. So I am interested in Trump whisperers and Trump amplifiers who may have privately contacted Trump but, despite having privileged access to public platforms, did nothing to dissuade either Trump or the Republican insurrectionists from sacking the Capitol to overturn the election.
*As a note, Republicans like to point out that House Impeachment Manager and House Constitutional scholar, Maryland Rep.Jamie Raskin raised objections to certification of the 2016 vote, but Republicans fail to mention that Raskin and other House Democrats made their objections for the record, knowing full well that no Democratic senator supported them and so their objections would not impede Senate certification of the Electoral College vote. Of course, in 2021, GOP objections were in service of overturning the vote.
https://www.c-span.org/video/?507744-1/rally-electoral-college-vote-certification
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XIKdGhVhbR8
https://texaspolitics.utexas.edu/blog/context-texans-roles-obstructing-counting-electoral-college-votes
https://www.congress.gov/congressional-record/2021/01/06/house-section/article/H76-4
https://www.c-span.org/video/?507698-5/senate-rejects-objection-arizona-electoral-votes-93-6&event=507698&playEvent
https://www.politico.com/story/2017/01/no-trump-electoral-college-challenge-233294
https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/07/ginni-thomas-groundswell-conflict-interest/
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/24/us/politics/trump-purge-ginni-thomas.html
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/courts_law/ginni-thomas-apology-clarence-thomas-clerks-trump-rally/2021/02/02/a9818cce-6496-11eb-8c64-9595888caa15_story.html
https://web.law.duke.edu/video/federalist-society-insurrection-how-lawyers-group-contributed-violence-capitol/
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2019/05/leonard-leo-federalist-society-new-deal-trump-judges.html
We had to lug them into the revolution
We had to lug them out of slavery
We had to lug them into suffrage
We had to lug them out of the McCarthy era
We had to lug them into civil rights
We had to lug them into gay rights
Now we need to pull them through climate, guns and autocracy. It's nothing new, we just must do everything we can to keep pushing this country ahead with liberty and justice for all. This is what many generations have done before us and now is our time.
Today, I am speechless ... No words can begin to describe my disgust and disdain for TFG and his ultra treasonous toadies-cum-bootlickers.
I am constantly amazed at how much I root for Liz Cheney. And how afraid I am of those who who are trying to tear down our democracy. We must keep telling the truth and telling the truth and supporting those who do.
Guardian columnist Rebecca Solnit added some supporting observations earlier today too. <https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/dec/13/america-witnessed-a-coup-attempt-now-its-sleep-walking-into-another-disaster>
So, when is Angel-hair-pasta-for-a-backbone AG Garland going to stop going after the little fish for misdemeanors and start hunting the sharks? As more than a few former federal prosecutors have said, they went after Mafia Dons with less evidence than now exists here.
It will be interesting to see how the R's vote on the resolution to hold Meadows in contempt tomorrow. I kept hoping all these investigations would get us here but my head is still spinning.